Is God real?

This isn't a literal meaning of religion, it's a metaphor. Good example.

I like how you selected the 5th and 6th definitions, not the 1st through 4th. Also, atheism doesn't follow anything devoutly, it doesn't follow anything. It encourages people to doubt everything and ask questions about validity and credibility based on empirical observations.

That's not true, in fact your logic is backwards. Most forms of Buddhism believe in a divine entity, while a few dispersed sects of Buddhism are atheistic.

Read example here: "Only in one sense can Buddhism be described as atheistic, namely, in so far as it denies the existence of an eternal omnipotent God or God-head who is the creator and ordainer of the world."

You didn't attempt to tackle any of the points I've made in my previous posts. Deflecting =/= debating.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 17, 2014, Original Post Date: Nov 17, 2014 ---

A better question to ask is if God truly is omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent why did he knowingly and willingly create a whole swathe of people who don't believe in him? And then why would he condemn them to hell for not believing in him when it was him who made us this way?

 

I attend a Anglican school and today in chapel they were talking about how Moses freed millions of slaves from the Egyptians. For starters, the Egyptians don't even mention this once in the slightest at all in their history.
Also, lets have a little example. Today let's say I discovered an x-rayer. In 2047, 33 years later I decide to write a book about how I caught these people. I think, and I am sure you would agree that this would not be considered a very good recount of what actually happened. Now this is relevant because the part if the Bible which tells us about Jesus's life was written 33 years after he was apparently meant to 'ascend' (I am sure this is not the right word) to heaven.

I would also like to add that you are right, there is absolutely no proof of this 'evilotion' theory of yours.
However, there is a lot of proof about the evolution theory. I would strongly recommend checking out this website from the Smithsonian Institute which talks about evolution. Another thing that I think is relevant to this is a convocation I had with our schools chaplain. I am not going to go into detail about it however what he said was something which I believe most Christians or people of any other religion would believe. Almost all religions have a god or multiple gods and usually they believe that they created humans. With the evidence which is available to us today, most of these people now believe that their god/s created evolution as we know it.

 

I don't believe in God either, but this is ridiculous. None of these are reasons why God doesn't exist. It's like, let's just say the Government is God for a moment. Four servicemen died recently, because the Government won't allow them to carry their weapons. The Government could easily change this policy, to prevent more tragedies, but instead they don't, because of mysterious 'reasons'. Is this an argument that the Government isn't real?

For your second reason. I'm just going to hope you know who BTK is. Let's say Hitler is God. He killed millions. Does BTK killing people disprove Hitler's existence?

Your third argument is just anti-faith, not anti-god, so Idrc.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 23, 2015, Original Post Date: Jul 23, 2015 ---

Let's not forget it's also part of the Muslim religion to kill those who aren't Muslim.

Summary Answer:

The Quran contains at least 109 verses that call Muslims to war with nonbelievers for the sake of Islamic rule. Some are quite graphic, with commands to chop off heads and fingers and kill infidels wherever they may be hiding. Muslims who do not join the fight are called'hypocrites' and warned that Allah will send them to Hell if they do not join the slaughter.

Unlike nearly all of the Old Testament verses of violence, the verses of violence in the Quran are mostly open-ended, meaning that they are not restrained by the historical context of the surrounding text. They are part of the eternal, unchanging word of Allah, and just as relevant or subjective as anything else in the Quran.

The context of violent passages is more ambiguous than might be expected of a perfect book from a loving God, however this can work both ways. Most of today's Muslims exercise a personal choice to interpret their holy book's call to arms according to their own moral preconceptions about justifiable violence. Apologists cater to their preferences with tenuous arguments that gloss over historical fact and generally do not stand up to scrutiny. Still, it is important to note that the problem is not bad people, but bad ideology.

Unfortunately, there are very few verses of tolerance and peace to abrogate or even balance out the many that call for nonbelievers to be fought and subdued until they either accept humiliation, convert to Islam, or are killed. Muhammad's own martial legacy - and that of his companions - along with the remarkable stress on violence found in the Quran have produced a trail of blood and tears across world history.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 23, 2015 ---

Evolution and the Big Bang Theory are completely different. Evolution is a proven fact: that species change over time to meet the changing demands of their environment. If you want to argue this, you can go ahead, but I might ignore you, depending on how tired I am of explaining simple concepts.

The Big Bang Theory states that at the 'beginning' of the universe, everything was in a singularity. It was all scrunched together. It didn't 'explode', it expanded rapidly. The thing is, people act like there was this huge void, and a little particle exploded inside of it to create everything. That's not it at all. That little particle was everything. As far as we know, there is nothing outside of the universe, and I mean literally nothing, as in no length, width, height, or time.

Now on to the origins of life. Scientists agree that a long time ago, chemicals began assembling in a fairly random way. One of these times, they produced RNA, which in turn, over a longlonglonglong time, produced DNA, which over a longlonglonglonglong time developed into a single celled organism. Now this is great and all, but it's hardly the best that there could be. This single celled organism was competing with it's other species members, when something happened. (this is all theoretical; we don't actually know exactly what happened). Maybe their pond got split in half. Now we have two separate gene pools that can evolve separately. Let's say the half pond on the right had more...ohhhh... We'll call it g^12, and the half pond on the left had more... b^10. Let's say they both had very little googybedash, which is what the organism eats. Well, now there's a scarcity of food. Through a mutation, one of the organisms finds itself able to eat g^12. This organism reproduces, and the ones that didn't make the change die off, and now all the organisms can eat g^12. That's evolution. Now let's say there would be an advantage to being twice as big. So now, let's say that the ones on the left were eating each other, or there was some form or predator. The bigger ones survive better, and therefore the species grows larger. But there is a maximum size a cell can be, and still function. So now comes two cells. From here, organisms develop to be more complicated, and better equipped to survive.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 23, 2015 ---

No, it doesn't. Evolution and Big Bang Theory are completely different.

 

why do atheists get so defensive about God being real lmao

most of what I've seen from these God debates are just agnostics/non believers saying offensive things against Christianity.

you don't see people that fall under Buddism/other religions (I can't spell anymore rip summer) insulting Christianity lmao

 

Okay you really did not need to necro this thread so bad. There are like, more than a few newer ones, and it's been almost a year since I said that so please don't point me out on it.

 

And what a sacrifice it was. It makes me think. I was watching a TV show a while back, and on it, they interviewed a WWII vet. On some island in the Pacific, he went through as much as, if not more, than what Jesus did. This guy was shot three times, had a grenade go off between his legs, and bayoneted in the neck, before being picked up as dead and enduring a five hour truck ride, before finally managing to sit up. The truck driver sees this, thinks hes back from the dead, and runs away into the jungle screaming. He never comes back. Two hours later, the guy finally receives medical attention.

Then there's this guy. Jacklyn Lucas. He signed up for the marine corps during WWII at age 14. He said he was 17. On Iwo Jima, he and 3 comrades were in a trench when two grenades landed near one. He dove on one, and pulled the other one under him. One went off. He lived until 2008, when he died of Leukemia. He had 200 metal shards in his body.

He didn't do what he did for his country, or the world, or all of humanity. He made that sacrifice for his three buddies. At age 14.


Then there are the estimated 15 million allied soldiers that died, in WWII alone. They all gave their lives, so that others may live in peace. So I ask you, what did Jesus do that these men and boys did not? If Jesus' sacrifice was so great, why has Humanity not been cleansed of our sins by these 15 million heroes alone, some of whom payed far more dearly?

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 23, 2015, Original Post Date: Jul 23, 2015 ---

Umm, yes there is. We can actually observe planets being created. Right now. Today.

It didn't defy the laws of nature. Nothing defies physics, because if something that happens that defies physical laws, scientists look into it, find a cause, and then amend the laws of physics, accounting for this new event. But the Big Bang Theory is logically structured anyway, and most atheists choose to believe it because it is the most reasonable conclusion for the evidence that we have about how the universe was created.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 23, 2015 ---

Lol, Ikr. I get so bored when people don't reply to new threads, so I dig up old ones .

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 23, 2015 ---

Islam does. Factions of Christianity insult each other.

And we're not defensive, we simply are angry that people would presume to have a debate with us, and then provide illogical arguments. Then bash us for being illogical.

 

I agree, these are just a waste of time and no one changes anyone's mind. In my opinion you can just sum up the debate with no one can definitively prove that god exists or doesn't exist.

Buddhism is a non-theistic religion based around peace and positive "karma" so that's probably why.

 

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/cruelty/long.html
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm

The same faith that says love your neighbor as yourself also says

1. "He who sacrificeth unto any god, save unto the Lord only, he shall be utterly destroyed." If this commandment is obeyed, then the four billion people who do not believe in the biblical god must be killed. 22:20

Which is basically what it says in the Quran.

 

I always get incredibly worried when I start to hear people talk about 'faith' positively. Believing with evidence. Wishful thinking, gullibility. It's not a virtue. Skepticism is a virtue. Empathy and compassion. Charity to those that deserve it. 'Faith'? No.

Here's a challenge for all of you religious apologists out there.

If religion is a force for good (or at least, where evil does not lie (as Kwag put it)), find me 1 good action that a religious person can do, that a non-religious cannot. This should be easy, if religion is so good, right?

But... if you want evidence of religion being a force for evil in the world? Open your local newspaper, or turn on the news. It's full of stories every day, of the actions of religious people done in the name of their religion. That are heinous, violent, barbaric.

There are millions of people around the world (right now!) that are being discriminated against, tortured and killed, because of religion. Religion influencing people to do horrific things in it's name. All it takes, to understand this, is that...

Religions contain ideas that promote/influence beliefs.

Our beliefs influence our actions.

Our actions have real-world consequences.

That's all you need to accept, to see how much of a threat some of the world's religions are.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 2, 2015, Original Post Date: Sep 2, 2015 ---

This might just be the most contradictory comment I've ever seen on the forum. Kudos.

Please don't visit the forums, if this is your attitude. You're actively promoting censorship and telling people that some topics should not be discussed. That is absolutely not true.

No idea should be free from scrutiny and investigation. In fact, the more 'taboo' it is? The more that people want to censor an open and honest discussion? The more we SHOULD try and talk about it.

Do not let this individual stop fair, productive conversations just because it offends them. I get offended when I walk out my door every day, by what I see in the world. You deal with it. You don't censor reality based on your own personal tastes. If you don't like what's being discussed, don't discuss. It's that simple.

The scariest thing here though? You actually went out of your way to say that you have a closed-mind. That people should not engage with you, if they want to exchange ideas and have fair debates.

"I really don't care what anyone says, I'll keep my opinion and no one can change that,"

This is the behaviour that should not be tolerated. Discussions about controversial topics? Absolutely.

 

I really agree with Nhjed, this is offending a majority of the server. It's fine to discuss, but the fact that you're ridiculing people is immature. Yes, maybe you get offended by things in the world, maybe some people's thoughts offend you, but that doesn't mean you should go out of your way to offend others. The fact you are taking what Nhjed obviously meant and turning it to make him look like the bad guy and make him feel out of place really shows how ridiculously aggresive you are. People will believe what they want to believe, nothing can change that. I don't see the issue with this thread, but I do see an issue with you. Debating things is good, but being a jerk about it is extremely immature, and makes no one, including me, want to debate with you.

Oh, and for this:

He's not as alone as you think he is, for one, I'm with him.

 

Why are you quoting me for something I said 10 months ago? By now it should be irrelevant. What if my opinion changed?

 

Immature eh? Let's tackle that.

Since when were you the spokesperson for 'most of the server'?

They have the choice not to engage with this thread. You might want to treat them like kids, but I don't. I want them to have the opportunity to engage with taboo topics if they want to. And if they don't? They are one click away from doing so. No-one's forcing them to view objectionable content. There's even a 'block/ignore' button on here. Use it.

You remind me of the 'Anti Breast-Feeding' campaigners. Breast feeding offends people... so we should just ban breast feeding in public.

Not on my watch. Treat people like adults. If you don't want to watch people breast feed because it offends you, don't look. If you don't want to talk about the existence of god because it offends you, don't.

Bar the snidey jab at the top of my post (re: Kudos) I did not ridicule him once. I tackle ideas, not people. Please do not conflate the two.

I'm not. Please prove that I am.

That's because I believe he is, and I believe I've explained why.

Hey, Speedygirl. The fact that you are taking what I obviously meant and turning it to make me look like the bad guy, and to make me feel out of place? This should how ridiculously aggressive you are.

See how vacuous that statement is? You're just telling everyone that you're offended. Cool. Suck it up. I've had people on this forum tell me I deserve eternal torture. You suck it up, and if they REALLY get to you? Click that 'ignore' button! It's that simple!

That is absolutely not true. So... everyone is a closed-minded person that will never change their mind, or doesn't want to change their mind?

Take a look at my profile. I'm here to exchange ideas and challenge what I believe. I want my mind changed if I'm wrong, and to give others the opportunity to do so, too. If i'm wrong, I want to know!

Cool!

Good! That's exactly what I'm here to do

Can you please demonstrate where I've been a jerk? Cool, don't debate me. Fwiw, I don't think you should shut down conversations merely because people offend you.

Again... so what? There might be many people here that think we should draw the line at 'anything deemed offensive'. I'm not. I'm a staunch proponent of freedom of speech and freedom of expression. Instead of censoring people based on... 'but my hurt feelings'.

I can't read your mind. I can only respond to the information in front of me. if you're changed your mind, come out and say so. If you havn't, what do you think of my criticism of your position?

 

Evidence in support of your statement is needed if you want it to actually hold weight. I for one and not offended, and I'm sure I can list several other players who aren't/wouldn't be by TheDebatheist's comments.

I don't see how he's being offensive, I see him being critical. If you can't take someone being critical of your perspective, that's a serious concern to me. Not all opinions are infallible, and you should aim to challenge your beliefs frequently rather than blindly believe them. That's what TheDebatheist is forcing many people to do with his comments, and it's clearly making people not used to this process uncomfortable.

Fallacious; your description of him being "ridiculously aggressive" is a matter of opinion. I don't find him aggressive, I find him curt.

Again not true, I've had many beliefs I've held strong to me changed after solid reasoning with someone else, and I've forced people to think hard on some strongly-held beliefs of their own. That's what a debate is for - if you don't want to participate in this process then by all means don't participate, but don't tell us how to run the show you're not actively a part of.

This is called an ad hominem attack. You aren't responding to his ideas, you are resorting to calling him names. This isn't a constructive way to handle a debate, instead it turns debates into flame wars.

 

They can ignore it if they want to. It's a free internet.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 2, 2015, Original Post Date: Sep 2, 2015 ---

Hi!

 

people have fight over god because other religions sometimes think that their god is the only god and or there god is the best god

 

Nearly always*

It's a characteristic of religion.

 

This is the second stupidest thing I have seen on the forums this week, co incidentally just after a post by nhjed! ^-^

 

I hate bumpers on almost a year old threads. But whatev.

Noobslayer, there's no need to have to offend someone because they disagree with you. Saying it's the stupidest thing is only going to cause stronger flame wars.

Yes, I'm a Christian. But I'm also a human. Humans do great things, become smart, be social, and have happy lives (ok some, I don't mean to put emphasis on that, so don't quote me on it). But they can also make stupid mistakes, bad decisions, and form negative relationships. It's bound to happen to anyone.
Why is Christianity so big? People realize, that, well, their lives are in miserable shape and they need to re-analize the difference between right and wrong, and that they want to change their lives to become more righteous. I'm in no way saying it's bragging rights to do try to do the right thing, because what they do is personal to them. They turn to Christ and the Bible for a reference to a better future.
And it can work! Not saying that it always will, but, if they try they'll succeed. Then when they do, they'll go out and be missionaries, preaching to lead people to Christ so that He can make an impact on their lives as He did with the first people. It's hard to convince people, very. Some will stay with their original beliefs. If they don't want to be converted, that's perfectly fine. If they're better off having a happy life on Earth, that is their own decision and no one else's. But to the other people that do, slowly, very slowly, they will see God's work. And then the cycle happens again.

Please, if what I say in any means is unreasonable or offensive to anyone, I'm sorry. Don't take it personally. I'm trying to stay away from pinpointing anyone who may be against my views. I hope I didn't come off too strong and angry. That's not my purpose for being here.

 

Don't be so apologetic. If people are offended by your opinion, that's their problem.

 

I could not like this more. Just because you're offended doesn't make you right.